Three prominent beliefs regarding salvation, held by most mainstream church-goers, and supported by texts from popular versions of the Bible, provide a real challenge for thinking Christians. They are:
1. God wants to save all people.
(God) intends all human beings to be saved and to come to a full knowledge of the truth.
[1 Timothy 2 : 4 DBH]
The Lord isn't slow about keeping his promises, as some people think he is. In fact, God is patient, because he wants everyone to turn from sin and no one to be lost.
[2 Peter 3 : 9 CEV]
2. God is all powerful, so always gets what He wants.
Our God is in heaven, he does whatever pleases him.
[Psalm 115 : 3 NIV]
We may make a lot of plans, but the LORD will do what he has decided.
[Proverbs 19 : 21 CEV]
3. Unbelievers will be lost forever.
Whoever believes in the Son has eternal life, but whoever rejects the Son will not see life, for God’s wrath remains on them.
[John 3 : 36 NIV]
He will punish those who do not know God and do not obey the gospel of our Lord Jesus. They will be punished with everlasting destruction and shut out from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of his might
[2 Thessalonians 1 : 8, 9 NIV]
Now let's put on our thinking caps.
How can all three be true at the same time?
How can we believe that God wants to save everyone, always achieves what He wants, yet many (most?) people will be lost forever?
As a set, the three statements are inconsistent.
A bit like this set of three:
1 + 2 = 3. 2 + 1 = 3. 2 + 2 = 3. They can't all be true at the same time.
Let's see how others handle this problem before I share how I do.
There are some Christians, who follow the teachings of John Calvin, a French theologian whose views became the basis of Calvinism, who believe the second and third statements to be true, so challenge the first statement.
They believe that God wants to save only those He has chosen to save (modified statement 1),
that He will achieve what He wants (statement 2),
so the remainder, the unchosen, will be lost forever (statement 3).
There are other Christians, the majority in my experience, who follow the teachings of Jacob Arminius, a Dutch theologian whose views became the basis of Arminianism, who believe the first and third statements to be true, so challenge the second statement.
They believe that God wants to save everyone (statement 1),
but God does not achieve what He wants because He has given people freewill which can override His will (modified statement 2),
so those who choose not to be saved will be lost forever (statement 3)
Notice that statement 3 (unbelievers will be lost forever) is always held to be true regardless of which Christian group anyone belongs to.
It is the only non-negotiable belief in the vast majority of Christendom, so other beliefs have to be adjusted to accommodate it.
Yet for me, this is the statement that needs to be challenged.
Not because I don't like it (although that is true), but because it is not what the Bible teaches.
Indeed, the Biblical texts which are used to support statement 3 are not correct translations of the Greek text from which they come.
Let's examine the supporting texts for statement 3 from above.
Firstly John 3 : 36.
Whoever believes in the Son has eternal life, but whoever rejects the Son will not see life, for God’s wrath remains on them.
[John 3 : 36 NIV]
If I use a literal translation for this text, I get the following:
He who has faith in the Son has the life of that Age; and the one rejecting the Son will not see (that) life, but God's ire rests upon him.
[John 3 : 36 DBH]
He who is believing in the Son has life eonian, yet he who is stubborn as to the Son shall not be seeing (that) life, but the indignation of God is remaining on him.
[John 3 : 36 CLV]
he who is believing in the Son, hath life age-during; and he who is not believing the Son, shall not see (that) life, but the wrath of God doth remain upon him.
[John 3 : 36 YLT]
The literal translations show that eternal life is NOT being addressed in this verse (and verses like it), but life in the Age, life in the millennial Kingdom.
Secondly 2 Thessalonians 1: 8, 9.
He will punish those who do not know God and do not obey the gospel of our Lord Jesus. They will be punished with everlasting destruction and shut out from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of his might
[2 Thess 1 : 8, 9 NIV]
If I use a literal translation for this text, those not seeing life in that Age are:
... those who do not know God and do not heed the good tidings of our Lord Jesus - who will pay the just reparation of ruin in the Age, coming from the face of the Lord and the glory of his might
[2 Thess 1 : 8, 9 DBH]
... those who are not acquainted with God and those who are not obeying the evangel of our Lord Jesus Christ who shall incur the justice of eonian extermination from the face of the Lord, and from the glory of His strength
[ 2 Thess 1 :8, 9 CLV]
... those not knowing God, and to those not obeying the good news of our Lord Jesus Christ; who shall suffer justice — destruction age-during — from the face of the Lord, and from the glory of his strength,
[2 Thess 1 : 8, 9 YLT]
Again, missing out on life in the Millennium in the Lord's presence is the loss worn by unbelievers. It is not eternal destruction.
It is only believers who have been chosen to live and rule with Christ during the age of the millennium kingdom.
However, the unbelievers, who have not been chosen for that role and responsibility, will be raised at the consummation of the ages when death is destroyed (1 Corinthians 15 : 26) and God becomes "everything to everyone" (1 Cor 15 : 28) so that God's plan "to bring unity to all things in heaven and on earth under Christ" (Ephesians 1 : 10) is completed.
To help convey the correctly translated Scriptures supporting statement 3, I would re-word it so that the set, as a whole, becomes consistent.
Here's the result:
Statement 1 - God wants to save all people. (agreed - it's a good summation of its supporting texts)
Statement 2 - God is all powerful, so always gets what He wants. (agreed - it's a good summation of its supporting texts)
Statement 3 - Unbelievers will not see the millennial kingdom. (agreed - it's a good summation of its correctly translated supporting texts)
Blessings, Barry
The idea for this BLOG was inspired by the theological and philosophical discussions of Thomas Talbott, Professor of Philosophy in USA, in his book "The Inescapable Love of God" published in 1999, and referenced by Gregory MacDonald in his book "The Evangelical Universalist" in 2006. (Gregory MacDonald is a pseudonym for Robin Parry, Professor of Systematic Theology in USA.)
Regular readers will have noted from my posts here, on my personal Facebook page, on my website and on my BLOG that I am not a fan of popular Bible translations without careful checking using literal translations.
Popular translations produced by a single Christian denomination have obvious leanings towards the doctrines promoted by that denomination, and those produced by a team composed of several denominations can be doctrinally bland because of their need to ensure that all team members' doctrinal positions are not violated.
In particular, it's disappointing to see how the NIV has subtly changed its translation of verses that imply God's eventual reconciliation of all in its most recent versions.
Verses like Mark 3 : 28.
[NIV 1984 version] I tell you the truth, all the sins and blasphemies of men will be forgiven them.
[NIV 2011 version] Truly, I tell you, people can be forgiven for all their sins and every slander they utter.
Notice the subtle change from will be forgiven to can be forgiven in the more modern version. There is no translation support for such a change, only a doctrinal one.
In my post "Which Sin is Without Pardon?" I fell into the trap of trying to quote the most recent NIV version for my readers without checking for its accuracy.
The point I was trying to make in that post was centred on verse 29 and I carelessly copied in verse 28 for context, without my usual check against a literal translation.
Apologies to my readers. I am usually more accurate and careful than that.
By the way, most popular translations find it difficult to "doctrinalise" verses that state rather than imply God's eventual reconciliation of all, as that would be too difficult to get past diligent readers.
Verses like ...
This is why we labor and strive, because we have put our hope in the living God, who is the Savior of all people, and especially of those who believe.
[1 Timothy 4 : 10]
For God was pleased to have all his fullness dwell in him (Jesus), and through him to reconcile to himself all things, whether things on earth or things in heaven, by making peace through his blood, shed on the cross.
[Colossians 1 : 19 - 20]
Although the NIV (New International Version) translates these correctly, I am beginning to understand why some people call the NIV the New Incorrect Version.
This especially relates to the consistently incorrect translations regarding age and eternity and their adjectival forms in the New Testament, and Hades and hell throughout the whole Bible.
If you're interested, you can find substantial writings on these on this BLOG, and on my website at https://www.ibtechservices.com.au.
Again apologies for my carelessness in the previous post.
Blessings, Barry
I have never seen so much theological discussion on TV as we have in the past few weeks.
Every political and social commentator seems to have an opinion on who will or will not go to hell, and even on whether or not hell exists.
Of course Israel Folau started it all just over 12 months ago and then reignited the fuse this year.
And Bill Shorten introduced the hell questions into the recent Federal election campaign in an attempt to score a political point over our proudly Christian Prime Minister.
I have previously congratulated Israel on his courage and bravery, while pointing out his need to widen his view of God's love for His creation and Jesus' success in dealing with the sins of the world 2000 years ago.
However, since then I have been taken to task about the success of Jesus' part in God's plan "to bring unity to all things in heaven and on earth under Christ".
[Ephesians 1 : 10 NIV]
I am told there is one sin that will never be pardoned, described as blasphemy against the Holy Spirit.
Truly I tell you, people can be forgiven all their sins and every slander they utter, but whoever blasphemes against the Holy Spirit will never be forgiven; they are guilty of an eternal sin.”
[Mark 3 : 28 - 29 NIV]
Let's take a close look at this verse as it does seem to contradict so many other verses which confirm that Jesus died on the cross for the sins of the whole world [1 John 2 : 2] and that God is subsequently no longer counting our sins against us [2 Corinthians 5 : 19].
Now, back to Mark 3 : 28 - 29 from the New International Version of the Bible.
Blaspheming is showing contempt and disrespect, often by verbal slandering.
The Holy Spirit is the Spirit of God who teaches us, helps us make right decisions, fully reveals the purpose of Christ's mission to us, empowers us and moulds us into the image of Christ.
The Holy Spirit's work is vital to our reconciliation to God and being shaped into co-workers with Christ in implementing God's plan for His creation.
So, blaspheming the Holy Spirit disengages people from this ministry of the Holy Spirit in their lives - keeps them separated from God.
Never (= not ever) sounds pretty final, and is meant to by translation teams who filter their translation process through previously held belief systems.
Eternal reinforces the preceding "never" so that the doctrine of eternal doom for non-believers is written into our English translations, and the plan of God to be the Saviour of the world [1 Timothy 4 : 10] is trumped by man's will over God's.
Let's give some literal translations of Mark 3 : 29 - translations of the words of the original Greek text regardless of what man-made doctrines they might challenge.
But whoever may speak evil in regard to the Holy Spirit hath not forgiveness -- to the age, but is in danger of age-during judgment; [Young]
But, whosoever shall revile against the Holy Spirit, hath no forgiveness, unto times age-abiding, - but is guilty of an age-abiding sin: [Rotherham]
Who but ever may speak evil to the spirit the holy, not has forgiveness to the age, but liable is of age-lasting judgment. [Diaglott]
Yet whoever should be blaspheming against the holy spirit is having no pardon for the eon, but is liable to the eonian penalty for the sin. [Concordant]
But whoever blasphemes against the Spirit, the Holy one, has no excuse throughout the age, but is answerable for a transgression in the Age. [Hart]
It looks like the uninterpreted words of Jesus in Mark 3 : 29 are saying that pardon is not available for a period of time and the penalty for committing this sin is also time-limited.
If we look at Matthew's record of this conversation we will see that the conclusion we have drawn from the literal translations of Mark are indeed the correct ones.
Anyone who speaks a word against the Son of Man will be forgiven, but anyone who speaks against the Holy Spirit will not be forgiven, either in this age or in the age to come. [Matthew 12 : 32 NIV]
Even the translators of the "eternal doom" translations have no opportunity to import their doctrine into this verse, so I won't bother quoting the literal versions.
Let me illustrate what this is really saying?
Suppose a criminal is convicted and sentenced to a period of time in jail. He is not pardoned or excused, but after serving his time he is then freed. Society does not keep people in jail after they have served their sentence.
A blasphemer of the Holy Spirit is not pardoned or excused during this age or the next, but after serving his age-during sentence he is then freed. God does not keep people imprisoned (eternally) after they have served their sentence.
Bible versions in which translators have inserted their doctrines as part of their translations need to be read with great caution. Readers of these can totally miss the magnificence and magnanimity of God's plan for His creation and adopt a diminished view of God's love and sovereignty and a blasphemous opinion of the value of Jesus' mission to earth.
I believe the Bible teaches that God is a God of unconditional love and supreme sovereignty with an awesome plan for His creation; and that Jesus was and is a successful Saviour.
So, to answer our opening question: there is no sin without eventual pardon 'so at the name of Jesus everyone will bow down, those in heaven, on earth, and under the earth. And to the glory of God the Father everyone will openly agree, “Jesus Christ is Lord!”'
[Philippians 2 : 10 - 11 CEV]
Won't that be a great day!
Blessings, Barry
